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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 13:13 
It is 20C here at the moment and goes down at night. For this test, I am not using any dirt at all. I have them in wicking type cups and the seeds wrapped in filter floss for the wick. most of the seeds have doubled in size but none have sprouted. I just unwrapped a few more and no growth at all. The water is the same AP water I would use in the future. At the moment the water is room temp. 20C. I do not have a heat mat nor have I ever seen one yet. They are in a somewhat dark location with zero sunlight. Pitch black all night for sure.

I think to be really sustainable I will need crops in all levels of growth from seed to table all year. The numbers tell me that I need to plant seeds every week to get new plants into the yield. I guess the average seed hot house around here must be at least 20 degrees C warmer. Like 30 to 40 F warmer. Yet I see the locals already planting their seedlings in the outside gardens for a spring harvest. They know something I don't. But they are all using dirt and fertilizers and who knows what water.

After reading that the US tested some pond grown fish from here and had to dispose of them as toxic waste I stopped eating them. Went to all salt water for now. Some people here will do absolutely anything they can get away with to make an extra buck. Let the buyer be ware never meant as much till now. And it seems to be getting worse. People are starting to get sick all over the place with aliments they never had before. It can be scary. If they catch them, they take them out but then 10 more step up to take their place. It is a vicious cycle in the complete food trade. Hey a company across the river got caught making fake salt out of chemicals. How low can one go. Another fake pepper out of mud. That is low but better for your health then chemicals.

Now before we just bash this location, this practice is now world wide and it is growing fast. People are desperate and will do anything for money. Knowing this is why I want to take out at least one problem: Plants with a lot of water in them. My wife took the lead on the outside of the plants. She sells some kind of cleaner she adds to water and it removes any chemicals from the outside of the plants. They bathe in a tub for at least 30 minutes prior to using to clean them. You could drink what ever she is using. It has no bad chemicals and is all natural. I don't know the English name but I could find out if needed. Plants come out looking crystal clean and much greener.

So I need seeds to start the cycle. The black thumb needs to turn green. For a city boy that is not easy. lol

Deuem


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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 14:24 
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ok well seeds need light, that will be one major reason they arent sprouting.

also, is the water 20c? if the water isnt cloe to that, then they wont sprout either..... unless you are doing winter veg. like peas.


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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 14:55 
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Quote:
I think to be really sustainable I will need crops in all levels of growth from seed to table all year. The numbers tell me that I need to plant seeds every week to get new plants into the yield. I guess the average seed hot house around here must be at least 20 degrees C warmer. Like 30 to 40 F warmer. Yet I see the locals already planting their seedlings in the outside gardens for a spring harvest. They know something I don't. But they are all using dirt and fertilizers and who knows what water.

I would do seed to seedling in a seedling tray/system.
You can easily fit 10 64 cell seedling trays in a small area and provide warmth (eg. lights or mini-greenhouse) and water (microject recirculation). Then you can control what you put in the AP. You would plant xxx tray per week or whatever. I have no problem using soil (seedling mix) for this purpose, but there are other methods the hydroponics and general seedling rearing community use.

p.s. also Yavs comment at bottom of the previous page.

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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 20:46 
Yavimaya wrote:
ok well seeds need light, that will be one major reason they arent sprouting.

also, is the water 20c? if the water isnt cloe to that, then they wont sprout either..... unless you are doing winter veg. like peas.


I have also read many places that I should not give them any light at all until they break ground, then light em up . There are 372 pages of hits for the word seeds here. Wow. If it is sunlight these critters need I will need to re-invent my wheel. My test 3 will be in a book case I have and it will never see the direct sunlight. I would either need lights or a new plan. Probably both.

The water is air temp at 20C, a bit chilly to the touch. The seeds are most likely in there shivering their shells off. I have 1 cup with peas but I have no idea what pea it is.
D


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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 21:05 
[quote="dlf_perth"][quote]
I would do seed to seedling in a seedling tray/system.
You can easily fit 10 64 cell seedling trays in a small area and provide warmth (eg. lights or mini-greenhouse) and water (microject recirculation). Then you can control what you put in the AP. You would plant xxx tray per week or whatever. I have no problem using soil (seedling mix) for this purpose, but there are other methods the hydroponics and general seedling rearing community use.
quote]

My head is beginning to spin off. Now I will research what ever Microjet recirculation.

I hope the Author of this thread does not think I am hijacking it. I am unfamiliar with your politics but I will try and set up a master thread for this project. My DARE project, I did that on Fishkeepers and one of the guys sent me here for more info. They are fantastic on fish and tanks, just light on AP at the moment. I need both. But for the moment it is AP I need to get down pat.

Deuem


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PostPosted: Mar 3rd, '16, 21:45 
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Interesting questions. I get the same with making biodiesel. Actually the same answers hold truth. Sure I can save money if I don't consider my time worth money. But that isn't what it is about. I constantly do projects that most of my friends consider extreme and would never do. I do them because I happen to have a knack for this type of research and development. I couldn't think of a better way to spend my time and the added benefit is of course the like minded people I interact with from across the globe gives me hope for our future.

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PostPosted: Mar 4th, '16, 04:38 
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Oneshot asked:

Are any of you getting most or all of your vegetables year round from your system?

Do you think/know/feel that you are saving money?


Guess I am going to buck the trend a bit and say: It depends.

Depends on a lot of stuff. So i'll say this:

- I paid off my greenhouse costs in the first year on plant sales ( grown for spring sowing) I think I had 5 - 8' x 10' benches.
- grew a substantial amount of veggies through the winter but they were all cool weather crops.
- in addition to growing stuff for the majority of the winter, I also had rootcrops I could harvest fresh. I don't consider them 'growing' because they were mature enough to harvest before the winter set in.
- Once the GH was up... my costs were just plant trays, water (tap), soiless mix, seed and fert.

Now, I wasn't actively using aquaponics. I just had an 8000 gallon tank in there to moderate temps.

Plants for sale were grown in soilless potting mix (standard for the industry).
Plants for consumption were grown in the greenhouse floor in normal beds.

I'm thinking that adding aquaponics will just add to my income. I have a few things up my sleeve.

So yeah, I do think it can be cheaper than store bought and you can have your greenhouse and eat it too!

BTW... Google says I am about 115 miles west of you, so we're in about the same agri-zone.


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PostPosted: Mar 4th, '16, 05:50 
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Deuem wrote:
Yavimaya wrote:
ok well seeds need light, that will be one major reason they arent sprouting.

also, is the water 20c? if the water isnt cloe to that, then they wont sprout either..... unless you are doing winter veg. like peas.


I have also read many places that I should not give them any light at all until they break ground, then light em up . There are 372 pages of hits for the word seeds here. Wow. If it is sunlight these critters need I will need to re-invent my wheel. My test 3 will be in a book case I have and it will never see the direct sunlight. I would either need lights or a new plan. Probably both.

The water is air temp at 20C, a bit chilly to the touch. The seeds are most likely in there shivering their shells off. I have 1 cup with peas but I have no idea what pea it is.
D



well most seeds dont bury deep enough to be in total darkness, some even go far enough that the light is more important than the water.... like Calea Zacatechichi.


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PostPosted: Mar 4th, '16, 06:09 
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Deuem wrote:
My head is beginning to spin off. Now I will research what ever Microjet recirculation

the small irrigation sprinklers and poly-pipe that give a fine/lighter spray.

they keep soil trays moist but are not too heavy to disturb soil or shoots.

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PostPosted: Feb 15th, '17, 13:41 
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'Making money or living off it is not my main objective. Getting away from eating polluted plants is. What we eat the most of and all like is what I will go after first to try and make a dent in the food quality we eat. And I will be trying the stagger approach also. The entire testing is set up around being able to continually grow and eat.'

Same for me Deuem,

Clean, fresh food is readily available here, but still I don't completely trust what chemicals/fertilisers have been used. Growing things fresh myself means that I get what is in season when in season and take what I need as I need it, plus it tastes better. Homegrown is certainly not cheaper though it is much more personally satisfying.

How is your system coming along?


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PostPosted: Feb 21st, '17, 05:59 
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[quote="oneshot
Are any of you getting most or all of your vegetables year round from your system?

Do you think/know/feel that you are saving money?
Brian[/quote]

I am getting most of my vegetables from my system, year round. With a family of four and 15 grow beds we produce more than we can eat and I give away / trade a lot. But we also only produce what is in season since it's an outdoor system. We still need to buy items that are not in the garden when needed.

We are saving money in a sense. For me, the veggies are organic and healthy so I don't pay extra for organic produce at the store when I have it available at home. Also, my system is an integral and enjoyable part of my backyard. I have near $10,000 invested so I will never earn that back in fish or veggies. But I consider that a landscaping investment so I can enjoy my space. I easily could have paid a contractor triple what I have invested to create another type of environment that would yield zero vegetables or fish.

In that sense I paid less than 10k for my backyard, and all the fish and vegies cost only what I pay for fish food, supplements and supplies (iron, seaweed extract, seeds, plants, fingerlings ...).

I also benefit from trying to eat something from the garden daily, and improving my family's health because they eat a lot more fruits and veggies now than they used to. My kids would never eat cauliflower before because it had no taste. Now it is one of their favorites. We eat more salads and greens, etc. Our menu is more diverse by trying to integrate the produce into new meal choices, etc.

So overall, I'm in line with most others, but considering my set-up costs as landscaping costs-avoided, my system was free. That makes everything produced a profit for me.

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PostPosted: Sep 26th, '17, 15:27 
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"Are people saving money with aquaponics?"

I'm currently playing hockey for my state (Victoria) in Tasmania. Due to strict quarantine conditions I couldn't bring any vegetable matter across Bass Strait with me. Had to BUY all the veggies.

Holy Crap Batman.....$3 for a few slips of parsley and $1 for a tiny lemon...crappy stuff I'd use for compost at home..

and on that basis.....HELL YES!


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