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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 4th, '13, 23:28 
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That is a lot of head! I am not saying don't do it, just be prepared to need a big pump.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 01:35 
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Ronmaggi wrote:
That is a lot of head! I am not saying don't do it, just be prepared to need a big pump.


That's how the system is running now. I'm just adding a GH. It's about 7 ft but will increase a couple ft if I add a RFF. I am over pumped now and bypass probably 50% to top of FT for air. The pump came off a lobster tank like you see in the grocery store. 950 gpm at 0 head. I'm around 450 gpm with the current head of 7 ft. Did you see the flood pic? It floods every spring so I did't have too many options. The pump is external and can be taken out in a couple minutes otherwise it would be submerged in a flood. The FT is elevated so flood water would only cover a foot of the bottom.....HOPEFULLY knock on wood. It usually only floods once a year but sometimes twice. It only stays up for 24 hrs usually. This amounts to about 2 ft of water in the basement. Everything is up on shelves and it drains out fast. Takes about 30 min to prepare for flood and an hour to hose it out and life is back to normal. People think I'm crazy...but I have a good time.

I can't figure out how to incorporate a sump so that's why I was thinking RFF. It would add some volume and get rid of some of the waste that is already giving me problems in the 3 months it's been running. I would love some input on other options.

FT on deck is possible. I designed it at 500 lb/sf so it would handle the weight. I might be able to raise Tilapia then. This summer the FT didn't stay over 70 a whole lot and it fluctuated from 60 to 80 in a few days at times. I don't know if it would make it through the winter. That is why the FT is indoors now. I was planning on experimenting this winter to see how the temps in the new GH go.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 09:51 
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Why not use a submersable pump? Then flooding would never be an issue. Is that really GPM??? If so that thing must be massive!

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 11:55 
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GPH...my bad. Rated at 960 gph at 4ft head.

Link to pump
http://www.marinedepot.com/Iwaki_MD30RL ... 35-vi.html

It's actually small and it was free as was the tank. It ran for 3 or 4 years at a grocery lobster tank and I have ran it for a couple years on and off for bait tanks. It is always warm and keeps ticking. Blurry pics from when set up as a bait tank.
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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 12:20 
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If you go by the chart...
http://www.premiumaquatics.com/prodimag ... -curve.jpg

At a 10 ft head I should be around 8.67 GPM x 60 is 520 gph. It has lost some power over the years I figure. I can't believe it still goes but i am waiting for it to quit before I buy a new submersible.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 12:29 
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Check out the Afnan siphon. There are lots of them on the forum. Search for it here. It is an internal type drain system. You would have to have one in each grow bed.
Also you should not need to do a filter like that. Your grow beds are your filters. Maybe You could just add another Grow bed.

Have you downloaded the book "IBC's of Aquaponics"? It is on the home page and it is free. It is a very good reference to Aquaponics. It tells about the sizes of tanks, grow beds, and number of fish in a system.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 13:22 
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Everybody knows that AP vegetables grow at 4x the speed of ordinary gardens and grow 2x as big with 3x the organic nutrients...

Obviously your system is just too new.

Jokes aside, you have a very nice system there, I'd definitely stick with it and let it mature. I, like a lot of others was quite disappointed at my first season's production... I'm hoping that because I recycled my media when I had to move and rebuild my system that I also got to keep some of the goodness from that first season and my second will be better.

Most of the really successful people have very established systems with a few yers behind them and generally, when they actually bother to test their water, pH around 6-7.

I've never been able to get my pH below 7.6 yet. Not even after 6+ months of a running system.

I've also never tried to bring it down with acid. Just rely on the natural bacteria action to bring it down.

Good luck mate and stick around!

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 20:27 
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Seriously, this cant be healthy.
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Make sure your gravel guard is big enough that you can stick your hand in to pull out your stand pipe or clean out the roots.

A 2" gravel guard is not big enough and while my hand will fit down down a 3" pipe, I have trouble actually pulling a stand pipe out with a space that small.

Even in a greenhouse, I doubt you will be keeping it warm enough to successfully grow tilapia. They like the water over 70F and even here in FL during the winter keeping my fish tanks over 55 F during a couple hard winters required me running hot water out to them. If you an easily keep your water below 70 F then perhaps it would be worth looking into trout if you get board with bluegill, perch and catfish.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 5th, '13, 23:08 
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Don, Yes I plan on a afnan or regular bell and have checked out IBC' of AP. I plan on adding another growbed. There are not many system with my elevated setup. It is also designed on parts I had lying around and the spring flooding situation. I just need more return flow and better access for maintenance. I figure extra water in RFF will help balance and I have some extra 55 gal barrels sitting around.

Tcshad, Thanks. The system is doing pretty well except for beans and cucs. I have peppers finally and romas toms are still going strong.

TC, I meant growing Tilapia in the summer in the GH. The set up now didn't really get above 70 long enough. It was a cooler summer. Do you still have uniseals for sale on your website?

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 00:14 
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Yep I have uniseals.

If you are talking about mixed gender tilapia, you need more than just summer months to really grow out tilapia unless you are getting advanced fingerlings and happy eating them small (6 oz). Even here in FL, to breed your own fry and grow out edible tilapia either requires heating for the cold months or accepting small fish or more than one season grow out as the consequence for not heating. And here in Central FL, the April-October water temperatures are usually between 76-86 F depending on system and location.

Now if you can elevate your fish tank more, then you will be higher above flood level (perhaps able to leave the inline pump in place to run rather than having to remove it) and you would be pumping against less head and there fore get more flow up to the greenhouse.

What is an RFF? and how do you figure it will provide more stability?

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 02:13 
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Radial Flow Filter. It's swirls the water and waste settles at the bottom so it can be drained off. It would be an extra 55 gals of water added to the system (100 gal FT). It should help retain some heat also.

With the head I get a bad siphon which sucks my media into the pump and stops it. The expanded shale I'm using has small particles mixed is. I could try a back-flow preventer but from my experience they don't work well with dirty water. I put screens over the outflows to GB's to keep media from getting sucked up but they constantly get clogged with waste. A piece of rubber (flap valve) over supply pipe would help would help with siphon. Gravity feed from RFF to grow would also help.

I can get some Blue Tilpia that supposedly do well at 60 and can survive lower temps for a short period. Then try a little breeding with my indoor aquariums. There are a couple people breeding them locally so I will have to visit with them to see how they deal with temps.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 03:11 
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Do well at 60 F probably means they survive. It is highly unlikely that they will be eating anything or growing at 60 F and breeding is not very common until you get up to 80-86 F.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 10:39 
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The point of the media guard is to prevent the media from getting sucked up.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 10:58 
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Ronmaggi wrote:
The point of the media guard is to prevent the media from getting sucked up.


I plan on media guards when I redo drains. I'm talking about media getting sucked into my supply pipe to beds when the pump turns off from siphoning. The supply is below the media otherwise it splashes everywhere. I should probably try a loop around the top of bed with holes drilled in the bottom.

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 Post subject: Re: Rairdog's AP venture
PostPosted: Sep 6th, '13, 11:00 
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Oh, put a tee at the highest point on your fill line. If you need to, put a taller pipe in the tee to prevent overflow, but you probably won't need to. That will prevent the siphon.

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