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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 16th, '16, 12:58 
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Has been great reading your progress! Thanks for sharing.


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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 16th, '16, 22:08 
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scotty435 wrote:
Looks like you need to adjust the light, the small ones in the middle show it best, they are stretching for more light. You're going to need some solids filtration if that muck is coming from the DWC :think: . Radial Flow Filters and Static Upflow Filters work pretty well (might need one of each). What's in your scoop is settleable solids (that's what the RFF will take care of) but there are also suspended solids (which the SUF helps with) that don't settle and without filtering the suspended solids you'll probably wind up with root rot in the DWC. Suspended solids tend to cling to the roots. There is a component of the suspended solids called dissolved solids (things like ions so this includes many nutrients). The dissolved solids will pass through either of these filters.

You do lose some nutrients by filtering the solids so most commercial growers and some hobbyists who remove the solids will have a mineralizer to break down the solids further so that they can be added back in. Grow beds prior to the DWC can do this for you without needing a separate mineralizer, you need to be careful not to overwhelm the grow beds with solids or they lose the ability to act as a good biofilter (which is another function they have in most systems). It sounds complicated but it's not that big a deal. Usually it will be something like one of these lineups

Fish Tank --> Grow bed --> DWC (In this situation you have enough grow beds to handle all the solids)

Fish Tank --> RFF --> Grow bed --> DWC (Here you don't have enough grow beds to handle the solids)

Fish Tank --> RFF --------------> SUF --> DWC (You don't have any grow beds)
|-->Mineralizer--->|


I don't know if you needed any of this information or already knew it but if you have any questions let me know. Might be good to give us a system overview, we like pictures :)

Cheers

Thanks Scotty , as always it was really helpful , will be sharing details and more pic soon

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 16th, '16, 22:11 
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can someone tell what deficiency is this ?

gourd seedling

iron or nitrogen ? Image

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 00:30 
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It's probably an iron deficiency which is common in new systems. Iron is not mobile within the plant so the first place it shows up is in the new growth. pH has a big role in determining iron availability in the system water and what type of iron you should use when you treat for this deficiency. Any of the following can be spray applied to get around pH issues with the system water and availability.

What to use if adding to the system water (I'm going mostly by memory on these pH levels so they'll probably be close enough but may not be exactly right) -

Iron Sulfate - regular iron mostly for pH 7 or below.

Fe-DTPA - A type of iron chelate that works up to around pH 7.5

Fe-EDDHA - Probably the best choice for pH around 8.0.

-----------------------

On my post about the solids filtration - The last option that didn't have any grow beds, the mineralizer should be a side loop between the RFF and the SUF. Somehow or other the spaces to shift it under these were removed when I posted :dontknow:


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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 09:19 
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Yup, it's definitely not nitrogen deficiency - nitrogen is mobile so the new leaves come in green while the old leaves go yellow and then die off. I'm getting an excellent demonstration of that in my system right now, the perpetual spinach is showing it very clearly!

I'm also not so sure it's iron? You get interveinal chlorosis with iron deficiency, the veins stay green with the areas between them turning yellow/pale. General chlorosis of young leaves looks more like a sulfur deficiency.

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 09:42 
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Thanks Scotty and melredcap .

my ph stays around 7.8

I have not added any iron . I tried growing in media grow bed, I never added iron plants were ok . only problem I had was no fruiting lot of flowers

by this chlorosis am clueless .

I live in South India , we don't find chelated minerals here . am clueless .

Any help would be great

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 09:44 
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Scotty y filtration not yet completed , am olanning for upflow and bio media and rff - 3,2,1 order . mineralisation yet to plan .

does root with lot of solids cause this coloring ??



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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 09:50 
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You could be right Mel, and having darker veins is the more normal reaction but it seems unlikely that it's sulfur. I'm still pretty sure it's iron but just a bit atypical. Notice how the lower leaves have light colored veins to begin with so if the interveinal areas are normally darker they'd all wind up about the same color - That's my reason for going with iron.

Eventually the pH will come down but for now, if you can't find the chelated versions, just spray apply iron sulfate if you can find it Sri :thumbright: . If you can't find that I'll look around and see what I can figure out so let me know what happens.

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does root with lot of solids cause this coloring ??


I'm glad you said that Sri - yes it can. Check the roots and see if they are healthy. If they aren't there's not much chance the plant will be getting the nutrients it needs.

Quote:
only problem I had was no fruiting lot of flowers


Could be temperatures, could be lack of pollinator, could also be caused by air pollution. There are other things that can cause this as well. I think I recall you having really high air temps with some tomatoes :think:


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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 10:28 
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Thanks Scotty . am cleaning dwc and filter , will keep you posted

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 10:29 
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Image

roots very bad in this plant , others seems to be ok . I doubt my filtration . will correct and keep all posted

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 17th, '16, 11:10 
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Ooh yeah, that would do it! If the other plants are happy and it's just that one with the bad roots looking yellow, Sri, that'll be the problem.

(Good point about the veins being paler anyway, Scotty! :P)

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 18th, '16, 02:06 
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Chelated iron may be called sequestered iron where you are so you might look for this also.


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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 18th, '16, 09:34 
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Thanks Scotty , I tried a lot , bit no luck .

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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 18th, '16, 09:42 
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am going to try Neem cake . For foliage application . that'sThe one i find here rich in iron

Neem cake is byproduct of Neem oil unfortunately Neem oil is toxic to fish .just ordered in amazon prime. let me try and keep posted



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 Post subject: Re: Sri's New System
PostPosted: Nov 18th, '16, 10:33 
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Whoa, I have serious misgivings about using neem cake this way. I didn't know about Neem Cake so I did a search on the Internet and found that it is a Nitrification inhibitor - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neem_cake and also an antimicrobial. I'm not certain they really meant nitrification inhibitor but just the fact that it's antimicrobial could cause any biofiltration to take a hit and possibly die out :shock:.. Keep looking there has to be something else around there, maybe neem cake is it but be really careful if you try it.


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